[Tfug] ubuntu (troll?)

Tue Apr 15 11:15:02 MST 2008

Michael -

I have an idea that both meets your needs, AND allows you to grasp the *nix
environment at your own pace (which sounds to me like a snail who lost his
way into a field of salt...). Go purchase a Mac. It is easy to learn, costs
as much as buying a pc with Windows, and runs a fully certified *nix
environment underneath the pretty, easy GUI that you so deserve.
Essentially, here are your options (IMHO): cost, functionality, ease of
use... Pick two. If that is not acceptable, then either help by contribution
of solutions or STFU. There are many people who are not considered Œtechies¹
that use products like Mac OS X, Linux (several distros), and UNIX-based
systems that are able to take care of their needs without the concern of
technical expertise. If you are not one of them, and you have no inclination
to be one of them, and you have no initiative to become a Œtechie¹ or
utilize the tools that are offered by the products that are available to you
at little or no cost....well, then why did you subscribe to TFUG? To bitch
about it?

By the way, if computers don¹t seem to work for you...there¹s always the
alternative, manual process. Maybe that is a better solution.

Will

P.S.

I am now out of food for the troll. Thanks for listening.

On 4/15/08 10:50 AM, "Andrew Ayre" <andy at britishideas.com> wrote:

> Saying:
> 
> "Because such simplicity is abhorent to many techies, I really doubt
> linux is going anywhere. It is a lost cause."
> 
> Is either a statement with no basic research and understanding, or is a
> statement designed to make people irritated (i.e. trolling).
> 
> Which is it?
> 
> Andy
> 
> sitkaa at email.arizona.edu wrote:
>> > I don't consider myself a troll. actually, if you knew me, you would thik
>> that
>> > is funny. That you see my feedback as trolling only exemplifies my
>> > point: there
>> > is a bridgable divide between the technically inclined and the not-so. It
>> is
>> > unlikely that this bridge will ever be more than a footbridge swaying in >>
the
>> > wind simply because techies couldn't give a hoot about making linux simple.
>> >
>> > I agree I could take some courses so I could figure out to use the
>> operating
>> > system. All I really want to do is use the computer for simple things like
>> > office stuff, connecting to the internet, organizing and storing files, and
>> > maybe listening to some internet-based music. Does taking a class at Pima
>> > College (it is cheaper then the University) seem like an awful lot of work
>> to
>> > anyone besides me? I not, then I suppose I am a troll.
>> >
>> >
>> > Grrrrrrr!
>> > Michael
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Quoting "Eric M. Gearhart" <eric at nixwizard.net>:
>> >
>>> >> Yes I would agree with the "don't feed the troll" post - are you
>>> >> seriously asking for help or are you just trolling this list?
>>> >>
>>> >> Techies "turn wrenches" and get stuff working... there is a level of
>>> >> "polish" lacking from Linux right now, but there are projects
>>> >> underway that are trying to address that situation (openSUSE, Ubuntu,
>>> >> etc.)
>>> >>
>>> >> Eric
>>> >> http://nixwizard.net
>>> >>
>>> >> ----- Original Message -----
>>> >> From: sitkaa at email.arizona.edu
>>> >> To: tfug at tfug.org
>>> >> Sent: Tuesday, April 15, 2008 8:49:49 AM GMT -07:00 U.S. Mountain
>>> >> Time (Arizona)
>>> >> Subject: Re: [Tfug] ubuntu
>>> >>
>>> >> I am the itinerate newbie regards to linux. I have been interested in it
>>> for
>>> >> over a decade, but haven't hadn't loaded it on my main computer until >>>
just
>>> >> recently, primarily because of the because of the difficulty involved
>>> >> in doing
>>> >> a dual boot, but also due to a lack of anyone to hold my hand to degree
>>> >> neccessary to get past first base. I can hear the chorus already saying
>>> >> that it
>>> >> is so much easier now with this application and that, but to me it is
>>> still
>>> >> written in Greek for all I know.
>>> >>
>>> >> I don't know how to use linux, I don't know what applications are
>>> >> available for
>>> >> it, and frankly, after a decade of watching this whole thing, I have
>>> gotten
>>> >> pretty disgusted with it. The promise of linux is unfulfilled. I don't
>>> like
>>> >> Microsoft, but at least I can understand it.
>>> >>
>>> >> You want to attract more than just techies to linux? Make it is
>>> >> sooooooo freakin
>>> >> simple I can understand it. I don't care one iota how little
>>> functionality it
>>> >> has, I really only wanna push one button, and then have the damn thing
>>> >> work. If
>>> >> it can't do that, it is too complicated.
>>> >>
>>> >> Because such simplicity is abhorent to many techies, I really doubt linux
is
>>> >> going anywhere. It is a lost cause. I suppose I will be sticking with the
>>> >> spyware, malware, constant updates, NSA backdoors, and
>>> >> anticompetitive busines
>>> >> practices of Microsoft as long as I live, cause you people can't grasp
>>> >> just how
>>> >> stupid and lazy I am.
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >> Quoting Earl <earljviolet at juno.com>:
>>> >>
>>>> >>> I used virtual box with 98 for a while and it worked OK for the
>>>> >>> limited testing I did. I finally deleted it because all I did was
>>>> >>> update spyware and virus programs and run them.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> Earl
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> "God made man, Sam Colt made men equal."
>>>> >>> "The fates guide him who will, him who won't they drag" Spengler
>>>> >>> "I want to change the world but they won't give me the source code"
>>>> >>> Unknown Linux Geek
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> -- Malcolm Schmerl <mjs355 at comcast.net> wrote:
>>>> >>> Jim March wrote:
>>>>> >>>> On Sun, Apr 13, 2008 at 10:22 AM, Jeffry Johnston <tfug at kidsquid.com
>>>>> >>>> <mailto:tfug at kidsquid.com>> wrote:
>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>> >>>>> He told the other that it wasn't as nice as windows, but it
>>>>> >>>> worked pretty good.
>>>>> >>>>
>>>>> >>>> Probably running Gnome... KDE is nicer than windows ;)
>>>>> >>>>
>>>>> >>>> Jeff
>>>>> >>>>
>>>>> >>>>
>>>>> >>>> The real indicator as to whether or not somebody is going to jump
>>>>> >>>> cleanly into Ubuntu or any other newbie-friendly distro is whether or
>>>>> >>>> not they have somebody experienced to help with initial tuning and
>>>>> >>>> setup. Multimedia support for starters, DVD playback, MP3 codec, all
>>>>> >>>> that happy $hit :).
>>>>> >>>>
>>>>> >>>> Gnome v. KDE means a lot less in my opinion.
>>>>> >>>>
>>>>> >>>> For REAL success, get VirtualBox running with an XP VM for those few
>>>>> >>>> programs or times we still need Windows. A LOT of users will have at
>>>>> >>>> least one such app, in my case the ones I need most involve playing
>>>>> >>>> with election databases.
>>>>> >>>>
>>>>> >>>> This works with surprisingly little horsepower. I'm pulling it off
>>>>> >>>> with a single-core Celeron 1.6 lappy, lowly Intel945 video and
>>>>> 1.5gigs
>>>>> >>>> RAM. And it'll work in a lot less than that.
>>>>> >>>>
>>>>> >>>> Oddity on that score:
>>>>> >>>>
>>>>> >>>> I rented a video recently that flat wouldn't play under Ubuntu. I
>>>>> >>>> tuned and tweaked and tried VLC player, updated LIBDVDCSS, etc. No
>>>>> >>>> joy. If anyone cares, it was the video-only final conclusion to
>>>>> >>>> Stargate SG1 :). Finally I said "screw it", loaded XP, downloaded VLC
>>>>> >>>> for that and watched my friggin' video :).
>>>>> >>>>
>>>>> >>>> But here's the kicker for a newbie:
>>>>> >>>>
>>>>> >>>> You explain that when they're on the 'net in Ubuntu,
>>>>> >>>> EMail/web/whatever, they're basically immune from
>>>>> >>>> viruses/spyware/crapware.
>>>>> >>>>
>>>>> >>>> THAT they get. Bigtime. The number of newbies getting hammered by
>>>>> >>>> malware is just crazy...that is BY FAR the number one reason a
>>>>> >>>> non-techie will consider Linux.
>>>>> >>>>
>>>>> >>>> You also have to explain that running XP or whatever as a VM task is
>>>>> >>>> much safer than dual-boot because Linux shields Windows. You lose 3D
>>>>> >>>> video support and gaming, but short of that it works.
>>>>> >>>>
>>>>> >>>> Jim
>>>>> >>>> 
>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>> >>>>
>>>>> >>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> >>>> Tucson Free Unix Group - tfug at tfug.org
>>>>> >>>> Subscription Options:
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>>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>> Jim,
>>>> >>> The problem with Windows, as I see it, besides the mal-ware problem, is
>>>> >>> that you get caught in a constant cycle of hardware and software
>>>> >>> upgrades. We use an old copy of Quickbooks, which is perfectly adequate
>>>> >>> for our business and which ran perfectly well on Windows 98, but has
>>>> >>> problems on XP and will cost $200 to upgrade. I use an old machine (AMD
>>>> >>> 750) which works just fine with Ubuntu. Will Virtualbox work with
>>>> >>> Windows 98 or ME? This really sounds like a way for me to go. Thanks
for
>>>> >>> the idea, Malcolm
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> _______________________________________________
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>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> _____________________________________________________________
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>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
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>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >> _______________________________________________
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>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
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>> >
>> >
>> >
> 
> --
> Andy
> PGP Key ID: 0xDC1B5864
> 
> _______________________________________________
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