[Tfug] NAS again eny4urat

[Bexley Hall]

Hi John,

On 2/14/2014 6:47 PM, John Gruenenfelder wrote:
> On February 12, 2014 1:34:31 PM MST, Bexley Hall<bexley401 at yahoo.com>  wrote:

>> [Are you here?  Or, freezing your cookies off?  :>  ]
>
> I'm back in Tucson.  I've been back since 2008 when I graduated from
> UMass Amherst.

Hmmm... I coulda sworn you were still back there, more recently than
that!  Though (reading ahead) it could be you were *visiting* at one
point and I mistook your comment to indicate you were back there
"officially".

> Although, truthfully, I'd rather still be in New England.  Maybe it's
> because I was born here and have spent all but three years in Tucson,
> but I miss the snow and going through four distinct seasons.

My neck of the woods, originally -- though I've been here ~20+ years,
already.  I miss the density and diversity.  The idea of driving
2 hours to get to Phoenix... I could drive 2 hours and be in NYC *or*
Beantown.  And 40 or 50 other towns/cities along the way!  (what's
between here and feenigs?  :< )

Once I left the 9-to-5, I *enjoyed* the snow!  I would make a point of
waking up really early to watch everyone try to get to work in that
mess.  Then, head back to bed and wake up later to "blow" the driveway
and sidewalk clear.  Much easier to cope with when you can do it on
*your* terms!  :>

I don't, however, miss the humidity.  Even Monsoon, here, isn't as
oppressive as Summer, there!  And, I wasn't too keen on -26F with a
wind-chill of -83, either!  (3 minute exposed flesh warnings).
Somehow, 117 (at 5%RH) seems far more tolerable!

>>> A bit late to this party, but here's my two cents:
>>
>> No problem -- but we're running low on *beer*... hopefully you
>> brought some along with you??
>
> Already imbibed.  :(
> That said, I tend towards beers of a thickness that require a knife
> to separate from the tap.  They may not be... universally appreciated.  :)

Probably a bit too thick for my tastes.  What I drink doesn't appear
to be sold, locally, so I've learned to live without.

>> And, I've got a variety of external USB enclosures!
>>
>> But, this is really a kludgy approach.  Each drive would have its
>> own wall wart -- plus the wall wart for<whatever>  is driving them.
>> [I am already sorely stressed by the lack of "available products"
>> that will support multiple wall warts on a single power strip...
>> having to spend 3 WIDELY SPACED outlets to accommodate *one*
>> such "dual drive NAS" would just change the complexion of the
>> problem]
>
> Hmmm...  I hadn't thought about the wall wart issue, and a router
> certainly isn't going to provide enough bus power for those enclosures
> that can be run that way.  However, I have noticed some improvement in
> wall wart design lately.  I've seen more and more that are no longer
> dense cubes but are instead, say, half-cubes, with prongs on the side
> so they occupy approximately the same strip space as a normal three-prong
> plug.

Yes.  Though the volume of the enclosure tends to limit the power
they can make available (higher switching frequencies allow smaller
magnetics and higher efficiencies)

If you are dealing with one or two devices, it's not a problem.
Or, with "bricks" instead of wall warts (though the brick then
needs a place on the floor where it won't get disturbed, etc.).

But, everything seems to want its own wall wart.  It's not hard to
end up with half a dozen on a single workstation machine (cordless
mouse needs a wall wart for its charger; digitizing tablet needs
a wall wart for its power supply; external disk drives tend to
need a wall wart per spindle; NAS boxen; router/AP; video digitizer;
external media writers; etc.)..

Most outlet strips are built with the outlets arranged so that
they form a pair of parallel circuits (i.e., all the neutral
connectors are aligned; all the hot connectors aligned parallel
to these).  This makes it easy to fabricate (two parallel wires
running the length of the strip with the individual outlets "tapping"
into them).

And, they are often spaced very close together so you can only use
every other one if you have slightly oversized plugs (i.e., wall
warts).

I recently found one strip in which the outlets were spaced far
enough apart (perhaps 6 inches?) *and* oriented normal to the
"traditional" way.  *And*, fabricated out of steel/sheet metal
so one could disassemble it and add individual switches to allow
for the control of outlets individually (i.e., plug in ALL the
wall warts, then turn ON the ones for the devices you are
interested in, currently).

*Perfect*!

I was planning on purchasing two of them to fasten to the rear of a
"library card catalog" (you know what this is if you think about it)
on which I have one of my systems located.  This would allow all of
the wall warts to be plugged *behind* the cabinet yet still give
me a means of accessing the power switches "from the side".

[Currently, I have a Medusa cable into which I plug the wall warts
that I need *as* I need them.  Tedious as that ends up on the floor
while the devices are all up around chest height.]

Unfortunately, the damn strip is 3 or 4 inches too long (vs. the
width of the cabinet).

No problem:  I'll just cut the thing (removing one of the outlets)
and make it fit!

Grrrr... the outlets are not "individual units wired together
internally".  Rather, it is one giant (plastic) assembly *inside*
the sheet metal enclosure.  Removing one outlet isn't trivial
(nor is inserting power switches as this giant assembly has
three long copper strips that run the length of the device that
are *formed* into the individual outlet contacts as it progresses
the length of the device!  Cut one and it no longer "supports"
(mechanically) the connector it feeds!

Sheesh!

Bottom line:  I will find some aluminum channel and buy some
individual receptacles (round, of course, as it makes it
easier to find a hole punch that will eliminate the need for
tweeking the holes to fit an irregular shape).

Nothing is ever easy.  :>

> Also, SWS sells this really nice "spider" power strip with five
> outlets.  It's cheap and I've got two myself.

I'm guessing this is similar to my "medusa" cord.

> No more issues with plugs not fitting.

Yes, but you now have a *pile* of wall warts sitting on the floor
(unless you support the "spider assembly" somehow).

> But... I know from mail on this list that your work area is...
> ordered?  :)

<frown>  Ordered != uncluttered.  <grin>  Rather, there's just
a lot of stuff in a small space.  Basements don't seem to have
caught on, here!  :<

> So, your milage may vary, offer void in Puerto Rico and Pinal County, etc.
>
>> I've also had frustrating results with external drive enclosures.
>> Many suffer from the "128GB" (IDE) limitation.  I spent several hours
>> two nights ago trying to understand why two "*identical*" external
>> enclosures mated with identical *disks* gave different results:
>> one enclosure reported the internal 500GB drive as being 128GB while
>> the other reported the full 500GB.
>
> That's just bizarre, but I, too, have encountered enough firmwares with
> "shortcuts".  Hey, it works with device X.  Job's done!

 From some research, it appears the enclosure queries the drive
manufacturer and, if it doesn't like what it sees, artificially
limits the drive's capacity.  I.e., use one of *their* drives
and you get full capacity.  Use a competitor's drive (which can
only be done by voiding the warranty) and they make it painful.

>>> I wholeheartedly recommend Shuttle PCs... but not for what you need
>>> here, I think.
>>
>> To be clear, are you recommending *against* their use in this
>> application?  Or, just not recommending *for* their use?
>
> Oh, I like their products plenty.  I just thought it wasn't quite
> what you were looking for.  I thought you wanted a one-device-one-drive
> setup,

No.  That leads to a proliferation of wall warts *and* network
cables/IP addresses!  I have a couple of "single drive" NAS's
that are nice if you just want to tuck something -- *ONE* -- in
a corner.  But, 2 to 4 drives seems a better value.

[At the other extreme, a shelf would be too much.  Been there,
done that...]

> but if you're looking for a box that can hold 1-3 drives then a
> low-end Shuttle PC might be a good fit.

OK.  That's an option I'm going to try (where are you, Harry?)

If it works well, I can (hopefully) set up several "identical"
boxes and just label each with its contents.  Power up whichever
one I need, move files, power down, done.

The advantage of having multiple identical boxes is that it
lets me standardize my support procedures (currently, each
NAS has different software, features, configuration options,
etc.).  *AND*, if the device I "need" currently won't boot,
I can quickly cannabilize the device *next* to it in order
to get access to the files I need -- without having to put
the "repair" issue in my critical path!

>> From some casual research, it seems like fan noise is probably
>> the biggest woe -- small diameter fan, "big" processor (vs. what
>> I could get away with).
>
> It can be, I suppose.  All of the Shuttles I had supported automatic
> fan speed control in the BIOS.  Also, I always replaced the stock
> 80mm fan with a "quiet" model and I, personally, never found the
> noise to be too loud.

Dunno.  I'm just reporting an observation from a colleague.  I'm
always nervous about dicking with thermal issues as that seems to
be more BFM than science!  :<

>>> The case design is quite nice and you can pack a surprising amount
>>> into one.  A normal Shuttle case can hold up to two 3.5" drives
>>> (one has a faceplate available),
>>
>> I'm guessing this to be the floppy/media card "slot" below the
>> "optical/5.25 drive"?
>
> Yes, though I always used both 3.5" bays for HDDs.

Is there much space around the "floppy" bay to accommodate the heat
from a hard disk?  (i.e., is that space *intended* for use for a
hard disk or just a "convenient repurposing"?)

>> Yes, the photos I have seen suggest a *shoehorn* is supplied with
>> each purchase to help you assemble the thing!  :-/
>
> Indeed, once filled the amount of working space is at quite a premium,
> especially if you ever need to reach in to fiddle with a jumper and
> don't want to remove the drives rack.

Another "report" claimed they suffer from bad caps.  A really dense
board will be a PITA for me to "re-cap".

> As for the shape/stacking issue you mentioned in the other email, I
> don't know that it's a big concern.  They seem very stackable, but
> then I never had to mix them with rack mountable machines.

All of my machines (except current "appliances") sit on the floor
beneath my worktables (tabletop space is at a premium).  So, its
no big deal to set a 2U server on the floor -- makes a convenient
*foot* rest!  :>

OTOH, my current NAS's would be difficult to use if they were
sitting on the floor -- I'd have to crawl under the tables to
find the power switches (some are located on the rear) and/or
plug in their wall warts, etc.

But, if these are "shoebox sized", I could set them on a dresser
where they are more accessible.

Dunno.

I gutted one of my smaller 1U servers tonight to see what I can
do to quiet it down *and* give me a genuine console (it has no
on-board video).  I'm always nervous when playing "musical chairs"
with disk drives out of fear I'll misremember which is which and
wipe something that was precious, etc.

<frown>

Time for ice cream!

--don